Off Road Historic Racing - your thoughts?

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

Off Road Historic Racing - your thoughts?

heyu · Patron, 2013 AORC CHAMPION TIPSTER

I am still.
How old are we talking? mine was logbooked in 1986 and my sons in 1988.

Do I qualify or not. It is the cars we're talking about isn't it.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

Im just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on the subject.

Cars > 20 years old restored to their 20 year old spec maybe? Just curious.

Stingray 2212 · Rehab Dropout...

I think it's a great idea. My old car which my son now owns was first log booked in 81. They can still be safe & are still a lot of fun to drive. Great to learn in, that's for sure.

I would allow modern engines, only because they are heaps cheaper & easier to get. I would agree with keeping them old spec otherwise.

-- Edited by Stingray 2212 on Tuesday 23rd of September 2014 01:35:22 PM

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

The spec question would be the crux of it: Just chucking it out there:

Cars logged booked earlier than 1990

Beam cars only
no bypass shocks
no shocks with shafts bigger than 7/8th inch
Production based gearboxes only (kombi, porsche, etc)
All current CAMS safety rules and regs

Were shocks with more than 12" travel available back then? Were beadlocks?

Not sure how you would accomplish the following questions - but what would be a good way to put the emphasis on fun factor rather then winning/expense? what else could you do to make them period correct (other than cigarette advertising!)?

Yeah, you'd have to go modern engines to keep costs down. Same with floating hubs, radiators and probably other bits and peices I guess.

scooter · Forum Addict

I will be up for this my buggies first log book is 1986 ! dont over think the rules ???? must look like it did in a period photo ????

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

To be honest I just like the old buggies as well as the new, and was wondering if anyone else had any thoughts.

what would you like to see?

Stingray 2212 · Rehab Dropout...

Yep, beam, no bypass, production "H' pattern gearbox. You could simply restrict the rear axle length which would control the travel. Better to allow coil overs on the front as torsion front arms are hard to get now & are weak. Just one front shock per side with no canisters.

Maybe rear must have torsion housing & have torsion bars but can have a single coil shock (no canister) per side.

heyu · Patron, 2013 AORC CHAMPION TIPSTER

Floating hubs!

What are they?

Mine runs 2 shocks either side on front. probly only needs one. no coil overs, tortion bars back and front.

Yeah! I know its a bit slow, but I think thats the driver.

BAJAs RULE · Forum Addict

Great topic. On reading the suggestions for class regs, there are sooo many upgrades I can still look forward to. I do like the axle length restriction. It would be funny to see a car with 19-1/4" axles and mid floaters.

Jokes aside it does sound good, but engine capacity I can see being a prob. I can only see 1600 being the choice from that era.

In rehab

I can see this is going to make me sorry I sold off, very interesting.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

So there is interest out there then. :)

So no floating axles then! haha.
Does anyone know if beadlocks were avaialbe back then - probably for the old centerlines. :)
What about big shocks (> 12")/big shock shafts/external canisters?

Stingray - yeah, I reckon you might be right about the torsion bars, although there is a bit of a revival for historic offroaders in the US so they may become available again. Were there many buggies running around in 1990 with coilovers on them? Its a bit before my time so I cant comment.

Hey Wayne! Hope you're well mate. where is your old car now?

Wazza - arent 1600's getting a bit thin on the ground now? Would N/A 2Ltr be a cheaper better option?

Fun topic! Even if its only hypothetical. :)

In rehab

Beadlocks sure, self tappers through the rim into the bead, as long as they're not too long worked fine. Borthwick / Horsfall 260 went to a mate of Warrens, I don't know if he has run it though.

BAJAs RULE · Forum Addict

260 was raced at colo state round as 132 and finished 1st in class with my old 2ltr Toyota motor. Was then cursed when an attemp was made to fit Mitsubishi 2.6 in it. 3 engines and no races later it was sold on to a guy in Bathurst I believe who was at Crookwell checking out the action. But haven't heard anything since then.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

ok... what about the non-buggy classes? what would be a possible spec for

2wd?
4wd?

BAJAs RULE · Forum Addict

Why did you go and do that? This thread was cruising nicely, and you had to bring up 2wd and 4wd.

Pedroski · Forum Junkie

Brilliant idea!!!!!
I would love it but mine is a 95 which is now almost 20 years old.
I reckon the KISS principal on the rules would work best.

Limit the gearbox to production except internals and that will limit the horsepower.
Beam front end.
No turbos.
Maybe a 20 year old minimum.

It would bring back a heap of great old bugs and maybe clean out a few sheds.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

BAJAs RULE wrote:
Why did you go and do that? This thread was cruising nicely, and you had to bring up 2wd and 4wd.

haha - keepin it intrustin!

In rehab

Find an old Chenowth Cheetah with glitter paint, swing axle gearbox, sand blaster jnrs on the front ,desert dogs on the back, fully worked VW motor with Webbers & all the Scat gear money can buy and a very rough ride, now that would be just ----------- Bliss.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

until you get the chiropractors bill.... haha

In rehab

Just re-read my own post, I'm almost exited, Hmmm, I wonder if anyone has a very old cheetah laying around, even without historic class it might be "fun", does anybody remember that word?

BAJAs RULE · Forum Addict

I can see it working, It does need to be kept simple as pedroski said. there's no reason why it can't be ran right now. As long as you fit the historic off road rules, you could continue to run in whatever class you are in now, but be eligible for the oldies award/points, just like first lady or first local home.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

I raced warialda on the weekend, the very definition of the word fun. :)

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

Good point wazza. You wouldnt need to make a brand new class for it, they could still run as class 3 or 2 or whatever. Just be eligable for the historic 'group'.

heyu · Patron, 2013 AORC CHAMPION TIPSTER

So I've just got to get a hans device to run that class next year. Right?

Stingray 2212 · Rehab Dropout...

For State level & above. I used one on the weekend. Not a fan.

You have to get the proper helmet as well, motorbike helmets aren't suitable.

Oh & make it times two as your navi needs one as well. Kiss goodbye to about $1600.

Wolf · Rehab Dropout...

heyu wrote:
So I've just got to get a hans device to run that class next year. Right?

If we used the specs we've been chucking around here - yes. :) SORRA next year? A historic trophy as part of the championship? :)

heyu · Patron, 2013 AORC CHAMPION TIPSTER

I could probably come up with a historic trophy easily.

Lost · Forum Addict

A historic class is one of the best suggestions to have been raised. Speedway and bitumen both do it and do it succesfully so why cant we follow.. AS was suggested before it has to be kept simple but SAFE... You could still run all classes and adhere to strict guide lines,numbers could still be the same but you just have a H at the end of the number (300 H ). I like the idea of a maximum length drive shaft as a restricting reg for buggies. Baja as per cams regs at the time.. Stingray might be able to correct me on this but i think that the Geelong club did something like this years ago as the Dinasour class and it seemed to work well.... lets make this happen..

Stingray 2212 · Rehab Dropout...

We called it "Datto" class Brian. It worked a treat & was very popular at the time. I think at its peak we had about six cars regularly running.

Restricting axle length is a very simple way to limit travel.

I would also limit tyre size to probably 31" & maybe steel wheels.